0000036933 00000 n Junior Member . 0000009527 00000 n 0000027918 00000 n endstream endobj 36 0 obj <> endobj 37 0 obj <>/ColorSpace<>/Font<>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text/ImageC]/ExtGState<>>>/Type/Page>> endobj 38 0 obj <> endobj 39 0 obj <> endobj 40 0 obj [/DeviceN[/Black]/DeviceCMYK 63 0 R 64 0 R] endobj 41 0 obj <> endobj 42 0 obj <>stream Interestingly, the spout/measure of the powder flask that came with my revolver only measures 19 grainsby weightof the blackpowder. xref 0000006802 00000 n PROOF MARK CIRCA PROOF HOUSE TYPE OF PROOF AND GUN 1891-1928 Budapest smokeless powder proof for parabellum pistols Since 1981 Ferlach smokeless powder proof for parabellum . 0000004035 00000 n 1969 = XXV. This site is an educational and resource site for collecting cap and ball replica revolvers. 0000013676 00000 n Crown CP (final black powder proof for the smooth bored muzzle loader barrels. Model: Reproduction LeMat Army Revolver. During the heyday of the reproductions, there was a great deal more sharing of parts among the Italian manufacturers than was ever suspected. The "PN" are the initials for "polere nera" or black powder. Over the years I was amazed at the poor quality control done. Abbreviation and tradename for Early and Modern Firearms Corporation, a manufacturer and importer of black powder and cartridge arms in Studio City, California. 0000003020 00000 n U.S.A.Most pistols exported from the United States are not proof marked in their country of origin. 0000003341 00000 n 1970 = XXVI. 0000001474 00000 n View Models. In 1888 it was decided by a joint meeting of the Gunmakers Company and the Birmingham Guardians that a new supplementary proof for smokeless powder should be instituted in 1893, 1896, and 1904; the rules were further adjusted to allow for new powders. The barrel pictured is a perfect example as it bears all of the Italian proof marks described. 0000077398 00000 n :idunno: I know it of recent manufacture since Pietta began making this particular model only in recent years. You are using an out of date browser. I am stomped any information would be great. No specifications as to the bullet. By This type of proof is designed to prevent the manufacturer from continuing work on barrel blanks which may have hidden defects. 1967 = XXIII. 0000109588 00000 n cases. Senior Member . A PDF link to Dennis Adler's article about Italian Black Powder Proof marks is given below. reference books that display proof marks and their meanings. The proof marks for Eibar, in Spain, are the letters Po, surmounted by a crown. 0000006823 00000 n This mark is found on guns that is not made in Belgium by countries that use proofs that is not recognized by the Belgian Proof House. xref 0000010518 00000 n 0000008989 00000 n In now represents definitive black powder proof except for muzzle loaders 1893 - present 14 Designates guns with rifled chokes. Taking the bbl off is the first thing I did - there are no markings on the underside anywhere. that we have found on this subject. CF - 2010. Italian Gun Manufactures Proof Marks & Dates 41 2 comments Best Add a Comment csaduck 4 yr. ago Many of us have Italian guns that were not quite sure of the date of manufacture, this is a list I got a few years ago (2003) and hope it helps out. Last edited: Feb 17, 2018. 0000016002 00000 n 0000010481 00000 n According to Col Robert Whittington in "The Colt Whitneyville-Walker Pistol", the fires Colt walkers were proofed with a "full charge" of fffg and a Bullet. 0000027315 00000 n That was the original article that I read. 0000080318 00000 n The first cipher is the crossed branches surmounted by a crown, and with a cross or star in the three other angles. 0000009831 00000 n It prompted me to get up and check when my guns were made. Weekly . In this video I'll. 222 0 obj <>stream Worldwide Logistics for all your products. The second is the crossed branches, with the letters A.E. {Za%a\#XDs9dE;*ci8=agercR"Vf|^z 96MXKk8}vd+X0L@skz j> 'th,6bB%t%]iNjNyksz+l4 C2&y*8NOalS?E:{'-~+[+GOk-cOcJ( oGljoR_Gb }6[w;vd ! endstream endobj 34 0 obj 782 endobj 35 0 obj << /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 34 0 R >> stream The well-known Waffenamt Nazi symbol was actually a military acceptance mark, and not a proof mark. 0000026203 00000 n 0000001338 00000 n 0000099401 00000 n The well known manufacturers did not want their name and reputation on a cheaper firearm, so these were sub-contracted out. 0000002052 00000 n weapon. 0000001247 00000 n View Models. 0000001623 00000 n 0000003744 00000 n 0000109981 00000 n Further changes were initiated, when smokeless powder necessitated more stringent conditions of proof. 36 Made in Italy". Besides these national collections, there are many municipal and private galleries whose curators have formed most excellent catalogues, but in the main this knowledge is uncoordinated. So, what follows is a photo library of many of the various Black Powder Proofmarks, Date Codes, Importer, Distributor and Manufacturer's Marks to help with identifying the manufacturer of your revolvers, pistols or rifles. hb````g`c`0 B@16Le7w'o{` TxMCS/xJe:JgNf_%B"\j %Ry\azM,Po}*;dA6a` q !I20d JPB`P!f)L|1>(x5 LN!A!p5_6&.g`xi,alhpg+. 0000012886 00000 n :hmm: Thanks for the help. It has an AE inside a box which indicates a 1979 manufacturing date. endstream endobj 43 0 obj <> endobj 44 0 obj <>stream 0000078152 00000 n Uberti cartridge revolvers are true replicas of original historical designs. 1945 = 1. Copyright 2019 sassnet.com These marks are the Belgian Lion rampant over the letters S.C.H. Bookmark Some of the tables stop at 2010 or so. 0000011515 00000 n Register today and take advantage of membership benefits. 79 0 obj <>stream Join Date: August 15, 2012. 0000049974 00000 n THINGS THAT GO BANG! 0000134772 00000 n Pietta. since 1951 Gardone & Brescia 1st black powder proof PROOF MARKS: ITALIAN PROOF MARKS, cont. 0000007161 00000 n 0000057470 00000 n They are often found in combination with proof-marks, and still more frequently on unproved arms made in countries where no official proof was existent. Interestingly enough, the Made in Italy stamp on the bottom did survive 2. PROOF MARKS: ITALIAN PROOF MARKS, cont. Gun Barrel Proof Marks. 0000038284 00000 n Thanks, Spence. trailer The fifth a crown, with three crossed spikes set over a capital E. Other French towns had their special marks, such as %PDF-1.4 % Liege. Of course, the date stamp is not on the barrel or cylinder, but the other marks are. 0000050678 00000 n "Proofs" as they are sometimes referred to have changed over Four of Italy's most highly respected gunmakers: F.A.I.R., Sabatti, Pedersoli, and FT Italia bring the latest in firearm design, technology and materials to the United States while continuing to follow the centuries-old gun manufacturing traditions of Italy. 0000037734 00000 n The DGG is the mark of Armi San Paoli, now Euroarms. for your continued support, encouragement and admonishment. 0000005765 00000 n 0000005085 00000 n Italian Date Codes. 0000002933 00000 n Location: High & Dry . You can choose to work with makers from Italy directly or contact distributors for a more varied assortment. ModerModern Black Powder Prn Black Powder Proofmarksoofmarks Unraveling The Mystery Of Iconsy Of Icons These are the three standard stampings on every Italian-made black powder revolver, pistol, rifle and shotgun. Uberti set the standard for producing quality replica firearms by which all others are judged. 0000013204 00000 n 2: A re-bored rifle. trailer I have searched for this site but can't find it. 0000067053 00000 n I wonder what the odds of a real Walker turning up in Switzerland are? I'm going to print out this table and keep it handy for future reference. From left to right: year of manufacture, Gardone V.T. Black Powder only Cal. A proof load normally runs 30% more pressure than its corresponding service load, not 30% more powder. xref 0000016641 00000 n Proof 0000110238 00000 n Your gun appears to be made by one of the lesser known companies as it doesn't say Uberti or Pietta. Their health and their love.I love The people I have gotten to meet in sass and the ones that have just talked to on the wire.I do like to shoot and pick on people at the shoot.I love the hugs I get and the ones I will get when I meet some on you people. The flag is your country of origin and is that the Swiss flag? Make: Italy (Proof marks are inconclusive to manufacturer) Model: Old Model 1851 Serial Number: E2690 Gauge/Caliber: 44 Black Powder Action Type: Black Powder Revolver Barrel . As a result, we have a group of markings appearing on replica revolvers that have taken a long time to be identified because of the special conditions in the market at that time. 0000037574 00000 n The information was given to me years ago and yes I was wondering myself how they got 30% more powder into the cylinders! 0000037713 00000 n Quick View Add to Cart . Well worth some research. 0000006039 00000 n 0000009920 00000 n For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. 0000002293 00000 n I have a Piettas revolver that is marked with the letters. manufactured firearms, such as pistols from Spain and Italy, will list a Yours may be an example. 0000003080 00000 n below are samples of Proof Marks of different countries. It has the standard Italian proof marks and date code (AD). 0000003880 00000 n 0000007642 00000 n Web site designed & maintained by Cap and Ball Revolvers . Beretta used no date code in 1944. Italian reproduction date markings Italian reproduction date markings By Brasspounder December 23, 2014 in SASS Wire Start new topic Brasspounder Members 321 Gender:Male Location:Fairbanks, Alaska Interests:Shooting old time blackpowder guns, landline telegraphy, railroads SASS# 9076 Golden Heart Shootist Society, Fairbanks, Alaska 0000002668 00000 n Uberti cartridge rifles embody the look and feel of the Old West. 0000039439 00000 n startxref http://www.powderhombre.com/mbpproofmarks.pdf You must have Adobe or similar software to read pdf files. and an eagles head. 5% DISCOUNT ON ORDERS OVER 5000 ROUNDS!!! ix)]'Aa-;O;KGg 6+Rg^vF$^og>XxZaNz:E 0000003452 00000 n These marks have all the characteristic appearance of a rectangle, with a small blob at the top rather like a tied up sack of corn. BICBWmaybe a call to PIetta or Uberti would solve the mystery?? 0000062418 00000 n I'd bet that CE was skipped as well (as are all "G" combos). August 19, 2012, 10:13 AM #8: MogrenE. It may not display this or other websites correctly. 0000008224 00000 n 0000001989 00000 n Posts: 14 . 0000004839 00000 n xb``b``` @16 l-,8sh-[1%3*.\ M=S!b6B>&X=ME#e*U3\'VC~Aa1 &w"2))vttgh \4 Tb@Rj hd`@ )fc``T v`#l> ^1?Y,Zi;?I+OT)po=|:U:EK{ mg`r#w /r] 0000074288 00000 n Testing the gun Their cipher or mark was the letters G.P. 0000039614 00000 n 0000055241 00000 n 0000004652 00000 n AN ITALIAN .44 BLACK POWDER REVOLVER SERIAL NUMBER D50212. It is becoming apparent that the major manufacturers used these shops as sub-contractors as a source of parts as well as complete revolvers for those distributors seeking cheaper and cheaper guns. 0000001752 00000 n SKU: FR185117. 0000012277 00000 n conformity of German Proof Law of 1891. This warning appears on the bar- HT=0+ @|7IqE.sQ"$9>tB}vUe&iF=P[mEjo(lHBRAu)0u^Y_8Ii)uLBAo*3 3SL*l4r_g[#}eF9ihFCym>s@MRFzaVLz8 Pietta. THE PROOF MARK IS A STAR OVER PN. Marlin-Savage-Winchester From left to right (upside down) are the test house and black powder proof house stampings, followed by a boxed BM, denoting a . 0000069587 00000 n 0000087569 00000 n 0000067226 00000 n St. Etienne, in France, established its proof house in the reign of Francis I., at the beginning of the sixteenth century. %%EOF The polished brass trigger guard and walnut grips hold true to tradition. 0000004339 00000 n 0000003674 00000 n This "certifies" that each chamber was proofed at 8,800 psi with a 30% plus load. From time to time, new data becomes available that corrects previous information found to be incorrect based on what was known at the time. Above trigger has has shield pn and AE. 0000001796 00000 n 0000046756 00000 n TABLE OF RELATION BETWEEN LETTERS AND YEARS FOR THE ITALIAN PROOFTEST HOUSE The second one PN under a star means BLACK POWDER PROOFING (P stands for POLVERE - POWDER, N stands for NERA - BLACK) (1977 and 1979) Now, if I had only had the presence of mind to write down that info when I finished the .36 cal brass framed pistol kit. 0000002445 00000 n 0000080518 00000 n 0000008549 00000 n In some cases this cipher is also preceded by the figures 16, and followed by a capital B., also surmounted by a crown. 0000011101 00000 n 0000000016 00000 n 0000117775 00000 n What you have there appears to be a model 1858 Remington New Army replica black powder revolver. 0000011853 00000 n 1851 Navy Engraved .44 Cal Nickel Black Powder Revolver. HMo09..0pl4jub(FZf=~$ABP(XLP Italian Firearms Year of Manufacture Look Up. The laws were remodelled in 1849, and definite rules as to powder charges laid down, and the cipher, as shown on the right [below], granted as sign of definite proof. 0000011024 00000 n Attachments 1LC_7209.jpg 259.2 KB Views: 601 1LC_7210.jpg Knowledge of commonly used military ammunition assists The PN stamp means "poudre noir" or black powder proof. Misc. All photos published on this site are the property of the author or are published with the permission of the authors. 0000102139 00000 n Some proved pieces exist, and are marked in the case of revolvers with the letters U.S., in the case of other arms with the letters V.P. The Model 1851 Black Powder Revolver comes with a hammer rear sight and a fixed front sight. Some of the better reproductions, such as those by Colt, Ruger, or Thompson Center, might tend to retail more in the $100 to $350 range. Large quantity of surplus guns and exotic guns, 155MM HE 107 Full Zone 8 Charge with Electronic Fuze, BA 312 Semi-Auto Magazine Tube Tactical Shotgun, BA 912 Bullpup Mag-Fed Semi-Auto (2 Different Mold). Also has pn with shield on cylinder. 0000126405 00000 n In addition to 0000131632 00000 n 0000001537 00000 n 1947 = 3. 0000013943 00000 n It is not clear to me when firearms by Italian manufacturers other than Beretta began to be marked with date codes - it may have been as late as 1954, with the Roman numeral X. Update: (This was originally posted in 2006.) VoEE&.i=Gjry&M9s PpIC9EeX Says made in italy on barrel. These 0000012438 00000 n This rifle is equipped with an elevation and windage adjustable Creedmoor rear sight and spirit-level tunnel front sight with windage adjustment micrometer screw. skootchingdog 4 yr. ago It seems fitting that "XXX" happened in the 70's. Proof Marks or Can be without . 0000008871 00000 n 0000136869 00000 n Established in 1960 by Knight Giuseppe Pietta, the company first entered the world of gun-making by producing hunting guns, including side-by-side and over and under shotguns. My revolver seems to have no date marks on it anywhere. http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showforum.php?fid/131, https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/modern-replica-dating-by-proof-marks.49482/, Pietta Full Fluted Cylinder 1858 NMA Pistol Question. with this information in an attempt to clear up some wrong information 0000051585 00000 n I will continue to add to the "library" as new marks are made aware of. The standard proving of weapons rose out of the need for protection on the part of the public against unreliable weapons, and it was also a means of protecting the armourer guild and good craftsmen against outside competition with cheap imported arms. xb``e``yhXa`+(y-[6zX8-dRRh i9W@Zu"vl=d*b5,JqXx ,8Pl}C;a>aN )10Zx'@ R3 1989 = AU. 0000050991 00000 n Remington New Army 1858 as copied by the Confederate Army during the Civil War. Rifles & Musket Information. 0000006260 00000 n 0000001540 00000 n The history of some of these makers and importers are no longer available due to lost records. 0000015377 00000 n 0000143308 00000 n 0000036564 00000 n Does anyone know where I could find the codes? FOOD, Military firearms can be difficult to identify because they 0000129535 00000 n 0000147394 00000 n 0000002659 00000 n Feedback. startxref 0000105108 00000 n 1946 = 2. 1967 = XXIII. Information, NRA I think it is a new Army 1858 but the Navy Arms on the top of barrel confuses me. for exports be able towithstand a proscribed load without damage. These marks are customarily the cipher of the gunsmiths' guild and the mark of the State or city. Hb``a``=P @1630i`@GDTVs(R {g i 23>`.0,p?PA! 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Serial Number: 12150. Also in that thread is a link to an article which describes manufacturer's marks. Armourers marks are quite distinct from proof-marks, and comprise the private marks, ciphers, stamps, or signatures of the individual armourers or gunsmiths. It is unfortunate from the point of view of history that weapons were not marked with a date letter as is customary with silver hall-marks, but the proof-marks stamped upon arms give no indication of the period of proof. Very unusual underhammer as the cocking knob is a better design so you can grasp it easier and. SKU: FR186012. 0000105711 00000 n These guns will also have the "NP" mark. 0000036825 00000 n 0000003896 00000 n New rule called for marking of gauge along with shell length for smoothbore barrels. arsenal marks, you will find other marks or stampings. Year of Manufacture: 1997 (BI Date Code) Caliber: .44 Cal. The major manufacturers could not meet the demand and American distributors wanted more of and different models of what were being produced. 0000011188 00000 n 0000010816 00000 n It has the two proof marks and the letters PN but nothing else other than the serial number. God Bless the USA! 1968 = XXIV. Anyone have the latest date codes? 0000096938 00000 n List of 294 Italian gun makers, Italy suppliers and sellers and distributors Home > Companies Gun & weapons dealers from Italy category Firearms/ Small arms 47 Ammunition 3 Ammunition Components/Reloading 1 Shooting accessories/Guns storage/Training 4 Gun Care 1 Gun Parts 2 Machinery/Manufacture 1 Operational equipment/ Survival gear 3 Airguns 5 Action Type: Percussion Black Powder Revolver. 0000115678 00000 n Dashing Leper 36 Cl. 0000037090 00000 n Predictably, speed jumped from around 750 fps to well above 900 fps. FEMALE PEOPLE, Tusco Long Riders, Brown Township Regulators, Firelands Peacemakers, Ohio Valley Vigilantes, Indiana Black Powder Guild, OOWSS, Umpqua Regulators, Siuslaw River Rangers, RUCAS, Jefferson State Regulators, Klamath Cowboys, Wolverton Mt. And with these symbols and date codes, we can usually track down who actually made the firearm. startxref Seen The Italian proof test markings are three (see picture) The first one (two letters in a rectangle) represent the year of prooftesting. 22 0 obj << /Linearized 1 /O 25 /H [ 1485 306 ] /L 118117 /E 82195 /N 2 /T 117559 >> endobj xref 22 45 0000000016 00000 n 0000007873 00000 n My revolver has 'Made in Italy' on the barrel, and the Italian Gardone proof as well as the Italian proof that has a star surrounded by 8 lands and grooves above the letters PN both appear several places on the frame and cylinder. >RPo$Q2y4%TCpu352ji%:@"BHUSYX}n CQCY}B%I"T4~S-2 +{gzIE$Or}a;nY 98cjdi (1 D,)} jh-@^z^gq}$g=@(M B{)C[ 1948 = 4. 136 0 obj <> endobj 1949 = 5 . All rights reserved. We have just started to assemble this on going source of Proof These marks are customarily the cipher of the gunsmiths guild and the mark of the State or city. It may not display this or other websites correctly. -Ec]]`iBd[&QE~t|J3Wva64v0-uy6Owi.x1:y14y=l*^>rv^)eO>S^)zy^Qp.6CTZ=_"qU[f!=xKw2"+pMlb/}-g%0_/3LA0G#%gC_`uC/}uEpV:+kk INTRODUCTION Most imported black powder replica revolvers are stamped with a variety of markings - Italian, Belgian, German, Spanish or other Proof House symbols, manufacturer's symbols, and importer's symbols along with an encoded date of proof, also considered the date of manufacture. Quick View Add to Cart . visiting our on-line listing of manufacturers identifying marks, 0000007663 00000 n ,!x#B3`Ev 0000001196 00000 n Definitive proof applies to all weapons and shows that the weapon has been tested with an overcharge of propellant and missile. Board Of since 1951 Gardone & Brescia 1st black powder proof PROOF MARKS: ITALIAN PROOF MARKS, cont. 3. But I am starting to believe this is true. ITALIAN PROOF MARKS PrOOF mark CirCa PrOOF hOuse tYPe OF PrOOF and gun The third is a plain stamp, with the letters A.V.E. AN ITALIAN .44 BLACK POWDER REVOLVER SERIAL NUMBER D50212. 148 75 0000028135 00000 n S. <<9CAB7C9ADE9DBB4DB23FAD02FA255802>]>> are cottage industry type weapons without a specific brand name. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Mf+wwJcC] }oUA!o=}OWWAn7 We have provided you Uberti black powder revolvers are exact replicas of their famous predecessors, and are built to perform reliably and safely with modern black powder loads. 1946 = 2. "Arsenal" or "Inspector Marks". A picture of your revolver uploaded from your files would provide the other clues as to what specific model you have. Proof Marks or "Proofs" as they are sometimes referred to have changed over time, therefore assisting in dating the arm. The two upper case letters or roman numerals in a box is the code for the year the firearm was proofed. HV{PTwjrh"1 fv] 0000010034 00000 n 1810 - 1853. It is also these proofmarks, especially manufacturer symbols/logos that give us a history of the firearm. 0000008059 00000 n Some proof marks on side of frame and the roman numeral XX. 0000001485 00000 n Once tested and successful the weapon was stamped with a seal to acknowledge the testing - called "Proof Marks". Again, thank you J. 0000111269 00000 n 35 45 1989 = AU. Flog?5BnS'Vz] Wd;No$wBj2O56~N)T%D-69_f)Bl[RfU[aSV. The "PN" under a five point star in a wheel is the actual proof mark. THE AMERICAN SPIRIT. 0000014256 00000 n They are built with state-of-the-art materials, so you can enjoy safe and reliable performance with modern ammunition. Spain depended for long upon the proof of individual armourers, and most Spanish barrels were marked with the stamp of the maker set in a square or oblong block under a crown. THE PROOF MARK IS A STAR OVER PN. 0000007017 00000 n individual armorers and inspectors used their own unique stamps in some %%EOF That mark is the Italian proof mark for black powder, thus your gun is or Italian origin. Serial Numbers. Italian made cap and ball sixguns have a variety of markings that denote the year of manufacture, the proof houses where it was tested and the manufacturers name or logo. 0000104236 00000 n Parisa cipher of E. and P. set back to back (as shown below). These include the It is available on the web from Adobe as a free download. 0000014945 00000 n Once tested and successful the weapon was stamped with a seal to Inspectors WWII German Codes & Markings GUN MARKINGS Please enter the markings you want to research and click the submit button. 1: A true smoothbore rifle. Caliber is .45 and barrel is smoothbore. 0000039418 00000 n The AE is the proof mark and that is decoded as 1979. Navy Model Right side -- Black Powder Only -- Made In Italy Bottom flat -- "BFB" (manufacturer's mark) Caliber -- 36 (.380 round ball) The top of the barrel is marked, " Connecticut Valley Arms-Made in Italy". Thanks for your help. There are typically three stamped mark on every italian made black powder rifle, shotgun and revolver. E.M.F. 0000005284 00000 n 0000105361 00000 n They went from BU to BZ 2004-05. 3l\9/OEK0joW/L242:ORES\";OhBzP%% - eupGHsP/Y$T y&$ iJ.iO7+asMi3>6fV#iBM u*wzY!.biCEy;Z7yA+lpNQFP+dV4N5t i ALL CAN BE SEEN IN THE P. on Jan 23, 2018. Thanks for posting those codesI use them quite often to make sure the correct parts are ordered. BA 112 Magazine-Tube Pump-Action Shotgun Brand: Best Hulu Arms 5% discount for over 250 pcs order. Uberti's extensive line of traditional guns has established a long history of reliability. 0000016410 00000 n Next is the mark which has "PN" - the Gardone & Brescia 1st Black Powder Proof mark used since 1959. 0000010481 00000 n Starting price $499. Thanks for finding it for me. This mark appears with the standard marks and standard load marks for the caliber. The mark is applied after the gun has passed the Belgian proof. Genuine Parker-Hale barrel markings - roll marks and proof stamps, A Comparison: The Zouave and the Mississippi, This is from the Colorado State Muzzle Loading Association [cont], This is from the Colorado State Muzzle Loading Association Journal. In the picture below you can see first the year of manufacture "BM" indicating it was made in 1999. 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